9/8/91 ** 8:02:14 PM Opening "EDCHAT98" for Chat Log recording. AFL Gayle : Our topic is software for mathematics tonight. As always, we have a free hour AFL Gayle : to give away to the person who uses the secret word in context AND stays until AFL Gayle : the end of the chat. :) MaryEz : My favorite math software is Davidson Assoc. "Math Blaster Mystery." AFL Gayle : I guess PA didn't care for your singing voice, TooT. ;) AFC Tooter : :(((( AFL Gayle : Tell us about it, please, Mary. MaryEz : :<<< BCS Frank : Toot got tossed out of Pennsylvania? AFL Gayle : No, Frank. P A Lott was here, but left the chat. :) AFL Gayle : P A is from SF, CA, actually. :) MaryEz : It has 4 sections. The first is word problems and the other 3 are problem solving of other sorts. MaryEz : There are 4 levels to each section and the fourth level is very challenging. AFL Gayle : Welcome, Moose Gunn! :) AFA Bard : Math Blaster Mystery is also available for Apple II, Mac and IBM. AFA Bard : Welcome Moose! MaryEz : I use it in the 5th grade. Moose Gunn : Thanks, this is a new experience for me! MaryEz : But it can go up through high school. AFA Bard : MBM also allows users to enter their own math problems - a great feature! AFL Gayle : What do you teach, Cheryl? Moose Gunn : I teach hight school math, algebra and geometry this year. AFC Tooter : Hi Moose! AFA Bard : What's your favorite math software, Cheryl? MaryEz : All of Davidson software allows the teacher to customize!! Also has record keeping. Moose Gunn : Hi Tooter. See, I finally made it! AFL Gayle : Oh, a specialist in our midst. :) AFC Tooter : Congrats. I thought you sold your phone. Moose Gunn : My favorite is the geometric supposer. I find it very useful for all levels. AFL Gayle : LOL, TooT! AFL Gayle : That's from Sunburst, right, Moose? AFA Bard : Ahh! Geometric Supposer's cousin- Geo. Pre-Supposer is also dynomite at lower levels. How is the AFL Gayle : Do you have a single computer in your classroom or do your students work in a lab, Cheryl? AFA Bard : Supposer typically used in your school, Cheryl? Moose Gunn : Yes! I started using it last year and it is tremendous! Everyone loved it! Moose Gunn : No one else uses it that I know of, not yet anyway. I use it in the computer la BCS Frank : Has anyone seen good software for Calculus students? AFA Bard : So.. Bob -- do you know Cheryl? :)) AFC Tooter : Hi Bob. Long time no sea. Negotiator : We better level with them, Cheryl. Want to tell them about us? Or, should I? AFL Gayle : Yes, tell all, Bob. ;) Moose Gunn : I guess you can. Negotiator : The Moose Gunn is my baby sister AFA Bard : (They took the bait!) AFC Tooter : !!!! Some baby! AFA Bard : Sibling alert!!!!!!!!! Terrific! Moose Gunn : Baby! I wish! Moose Gunn : Watch it Tooter! AFA Bard : There are a couple of Calculus programs in our AED libraries. Some of our Calc. folks are using Mathematica, too, Frank. But's it's strictly Mac. Moose Gunn : What about good software for Algebra !? AFA Bard : There's also a GREAT Calculus HyperStudio stack in our STACKWARE library. AFL Gayle : Algeblaster, Cheryl. AFL Gayle : Also by Davidson. MaryEz : Davidson Asso. also has Algeblaster. AFL Gayle : What's the name of the stack, Bard? MaryEz : GMTA AFA Bard : GMTA, Gayle. It's wonderful for an intro. level. BCS Frank : Ahhh... I'll have to look at that stack... Thanks! AFL Gayle : One of my friends who had to teach algebra and was rusty on it used Algeblaster AFL Gayle : to refresh her memory. :) Moose Gunn : I'll have to take a look at them. Thanks! Negotiator : Bard, is the Mathematica program itself, or the junior version in the library? AFA Bard : Calculus - Gayle. It's WAY down in the library, though. AFA Bard : Neither, Bob. It's a full blown, commercial thing. It's VERY versatile and a memory hog - but it'll AFA Bard : do EVERYTHING from fractions to fractals. :) AFL Gayle : Thanks, Bard. Obviously, best found by using the new keyword search tool for AFL Gayle : the libraries. :) AFA Bard : Right! :) AFL Gayle : Frank, what is your all time favorite math program? AFA Bard : There's also an Algebra program in our AED MATH library (Called ALGEBRA) Not a bad review! Negotiator : Yes, Bard, Mathematica is expensive. I have a copy of MILO, same thing only abreviated and cheaper AFA Bard : Yep, Bob. Great program, too. MILO is for MAC/IBM. BCS Frank : I really don't have one, but then I haven't used any either. BCS Frank : Marty, Hi there :) AFL Gayle : Oh, you're such a wizard at math, you don't need one. :) AFL Marty : Hiya AFA Bard : Hiya Marty! AFL Gayle : Hi, Marty! :) What is your favorite math program? AFL Marty : The Factory from Sunburst. BCS Frank : ... but I do have a son entering High School.. want some program ready for him. AFL Gayle : Could you tell us a little bit about the program, please, Marty? AFL Marty : The Factory is basically a program designed to help students think logically AFL Gayle : Gee, it's sounds as though you must be a teacher (or a forum leader. ;) AFL Marty : about problem solving. AFL Marty : The student is presented with a "product" (a design of sorts, really)... TEACHER ms : Hello, Bard and Frank :) AFL Marty : and a series of "machines". AFL Gayle : Welcome, Steve! :) Moose Gunn : What grade level is the Factory appropriate for? AFA Bard : FACTORY's also from Sunburst. It's Granddaddy,called SuperFactory, is a 3-D version. Great stuff! AFC SteveB : Hi Gayle! Hey everyone! :) AFL Marty : The student has to figure out how to create the "product" by putting AFL Marty : the raw material through the "machines" in the correct order. AFL Marty : We use Factory with 8th graders. AFA Bard : I've seen Super Factory used through the 9th grade. MaryEz : Our 6th grade math teachers use it also. They like it very much. AFL Marty : Super Factory is also good. A bit too hard for the lower ability students. AFA Bard : Anyone out there use LOGO or LOGOWriter for math? AFL Marty : ick AFL Gayle : Also we will be opening a Direct Connect area soon with Delta Drawing Today, MaryEz : Yes. We write tessalation procedures with LOGOWriter!! Great fun. Negotiator : No, primary schools do. I do not much care for LOGO AFL Marty : (Sorry... just a knee-jerk reaction to Logo) AFL Gayle : a program somewhat similar to LOGO that can be used for math. AFL Gayle : Why don't you like LOGO, Marty and Bob?? BCS Frank : That's great! I've seen Delta Drawing... powerful program. AFL Marty : I guess it's because I could never understand or see what the big deal was AFL Marty : about it. Moose Gunn : My son used LOGO in elementary school, and found it not much of a challenge. AFL Gayle : Delta Drawing Today is new and improved, Frank. MaryEz : LOGO is great for problem solving. Positive and negative integers, coordinates, patterns, etc. Negotiator : I agree, Marty. The turtles in LOGO are fun for awhile but other application software or languages Negotiator : can do the job better AFL Marty : Sorry, I just don't see it as that hot a tool. AFL Marty : Especially once the novelty wears off. AFL Gayle : Welcome, Alfa! :) AFL Marty : Most of my word processing students retch when I mention Logo. :) AFA Bard : Hiya Alfa! AFA Bard : Now, Marty. Attitude! My students used tohe same reaction to BASIC. :) MaryEz : We don't use it for word processing at all! AFC SteveB : right 90 forward 50 :) AFL Gayle : Do they use it in the elementary grades in your school system, Marty? AFL Marty : I guess I wasn't clear... AFL Marty : School system here uses it extensively in the elementary grades... AFL Gayle : Welcome, John! :) AFL Marty : When the kids get to me they pretty much hate it. MaryEz : But it does so much more than squares and circles! AFA Bard : Sounds like a teacher training issue to me, Marty. It's certainly not the BEST program, but it has a Member9167 : bye AFL Gayle : Maybe that has to do more with the teaching than the program, Marty? AFA Bard : role. Exploration is the key. LOGO is more a philosophy than a program. JohnR65 : Hi. I thought I'd stop by and check on things for my wife. she's the math teacher. AFA Bard : I agree, Mary. AlfaSaab : bye AFL Marty : Perhaps. But I've seen Logo and I've played with it. I just don't agree AFC SteveB : I think HyperCard and HyperTalk is the logo of the 90's..plus MUCH more! AFL Marty : with the majority who claim it's the greatest thing since sliced bread. AFL Marty : Steve... you used to program in Logo, didn't you? AFC SteveB : ::cringe:: Ayup :) AFL Gayle : What does she teach, John? (Happy to see another Tar Heel here. :) AFC SteveB : Back in Elem. school. AFC Tooter : Math, Gayle. AFL Marty : "cringe" <-- an unsolicited comment :) AFL Gayle : TooT, there are a lot of subjects in math! JohnR65 : She teaches math of varying levels at a high school in Charloote. AFC Tooter : Sorry, just being fresh, Gayle. AFL Gayle : Ah, good old Mecklenburg County. What kind of computers does she use? JohnR65 : She has 4 IIgs at school (one's at home) we also have a Mac and an IBM. AFL Gayle : I take it you didn't enjoy programming in LOGO, Steve? Moose Gunn : I'm looking for something to make per cents fun and interesting. Any ideas? AFA Bard : Math Blaster Mystery does percentages. Depending on the level, you might also try some of the MECC AFA Bard : programs, too. BCS Frank : Card games are a good way to teach percentages... esp. poker. AFL Gayle : That's Frank all right. Always a practical suggestion. :) AFC SteveB : Well Gayle... Moose Gunn : I can see the headlines now -- POKER BEING TAUGHT IN SCHOOL! BCS Frank : AFL Gayle : LOL, Frank! :) AFC SteveB : I liked it when I was VERY young, but it got less exciting as I got older. AFL Gayle : Welcome, Russell! AFC Tooter : That's OK Cheryl. We play Hombre in 18th century lit every year. TEACHER ms : Gamco's Math Football includes Percent !! BCS Frank : Steve is going to say he used to play poker in grade school as well. :) AFL Gayle : VERY young= about how old, Steve? AFC SteveB : I made my first Logo program when I was 6...still have the disk... :) AFC SteveB : LOL Frank! AFA Bard : Right, Murray. Middle School students really like that one! AFL Gayle : Well, Steve. Maybe you should upload it to the libraries here so we can see AFL Gayle : it. ;) MaryEz : At least a deck of cards is within the limits of most budgets. ;) TEACHER ms : Yeah, super program !! AFC SteveB : Young= 6 or 6, Gayle :) AFC SteveB : Well, I've always wanted to look back at them... AFC SteveB : but I don't have a 5.25 :( AFL Gayle : Go ahead. We won't tell Marty that you're doing it. ;) AFC SteveB : Snd you wouldn't want to see them ;D AFC SteveB : LOL :) AFC SteveB : Gotta find the disk, too... JohnR65 : There are several poker programs in the files. BCS Frank : No wonder you think HyperTalk is the Logo of the '90s.... AFC SteveB : Last time I used it was when I was 9 trying it with a C64... :) BCS Frank : ... if you believe that all II's are gs's with Hard Drives. :) AFC SteveB : Well, err...umm... ;) AFL Gayle : Is HyperTalk something that could be used in math classes, Steve and Frank? AFL Gayle : (and I'm sure Marty has an opinion, too. :) AFC SteveB : I woukd think so...SANE is very powerful! AFL Marty : HyperTalk is the BASIC of the 90's. AFA Bard : Bob........... Great to see ya! What's YOUR favorite math software? BCS Frank : HyperTalk certainly could be used in math classes..... has full access to gs math functions. AFA Bard : Welcome JTIPP! AFL Bobloo : Hmmm...I like some of the scholastic stuff.. AFL Bobloo : Math Shop...Math Shop Jr. AFL Bobloo : And some new stuff from Scott Foresman AFL Bobloo : for probability and all. AFA Bard : Ah.. Math Shop! Can you say a few words about Math Shop and the SF stuff? TEACHER ms : Yes, Scholastic has some good math stuff, Bob :) AFL Bobloo : Hmmm...few words... well... Negotiator : What grade levels is MAth Shop for, what does it do? AFL Bobloo : The scholastic stuff is Math Shop, Math Shop Jr, and Algebra shop AFL Marty : It'd probably be better to use a stack designed to teach or reinforce a concept AFL Bobloo : Math Shop Jr can probably be used from grades 2 ->> AFL Marty : than to try to use HyperTalk directly with students. AFL Bobloo : Math Shop starts maybe 3rd grade enrichment.. AFL Bobloo : Basic facts ... measurement, etc AFL Bobloo : Easy to use... AFL Bobloo : and fun. Negotiator : Is it for Middle School and High School also? AFL Bobloo : Math Shop can be used for Middle ... AFC SteveB : IMHO HyperTalk is an ideal tool for use with students... AFL Bobloo : As can Algebra Shop... BCS Frank : Yes, but using HyperTalk to write math stacks will certainly develope the BCS Frank : programmer's math ability. :) AFC SteveB : since it's easy, fun, and brings structured programming. AFL Bobloo : I wouldn't think you would use them for high school, however, except in a remedial situation TEACHER ms : Yes, Math Shop can be used in H. S. AFL Bobloo : Well... there ya go...:) AFL Marty : Which students? AFC SteveB : :) MaryEz : When I was a Chapter I teacher I used the donut shop all the time for fractions. Negotiator : How costly is Math Shop? AFC SteveB : Any students, all ages imho. AFL Gayle : Who makes that program, Mary? MaryEz : In the 7th and 8th grade TEACHER ms : Yes, I used it in Chapter 1 AFL Marty : We have students who can't spell their name correctly twice in a row. MaryEz : It's one of the shops in Math Shop. AFL Bobloo : Math Shop is about $39 or $49?? AFL Marty : Care to show them HyperTalk? :) TEACHER ms : Scholastic AFA Bard : You can get it Mail order (check your InCider) for around $35.00. BCS Frank : Maybe they can use a macro? AFC SteveB : Marty, I don't think they'll do much better with LOGO or BASIC then. AFL Bobloo : And... you can now site license the scholastic stuff AFL Marty : No argument there. AFC SteveB : HyperTalk is more forgiving. AFL Marty : (But I wasn't making a case for Logo or Basic) AFA Bard : AlgebraShop (Scholastic) is also pretty good for teaching basic algebra form and function. AFC SteveB : And is object oriented to a point...point 'n' click. Negotiator : Bobloo, how deep is the AlgebraShop conceptually - just algebra I or algebra II too? JohnR65 : anyone got an address? BCS Frank : Steve, I'd like to see the same students try the new HyperStudio 3.0 MaryEz : At least with LOGO you have to do more than point and click!! AFC SteveB : With HyperCard you have to do more too, Mary. BCS Frank : Studio.Scripting... it's like HyperTalk but much more point 'n click. AFL Marty : I'd just as soon see a good stack that the kids could use for exploring AFC SteveB : True Frank... :) AFL Marty : various concepts. AFL Marty : Percents, for instance. TEACHER ms : Algebra I AFL Marty : Or fractions (everybody's favorite) AFL Gayle : Bard, how about telling us what are the best math programs in our libraries AFL Gayle : here in AED? AFA Bard : Sure... AFA Bard : Need a "quck and dirty" drill and practice program for K-4 kids? Try MATH V.1.1. ---- AFL Bobloo : sorry about that... was in some IM's... AFL Bobloo : Algebra Shop is pretty elementary. AFA Bard : the METRIC MEASURE TUTORIAL is a great way to get kids in 4-8 interested in Conversions -- AFA Bard : FLASH CARD is a user-configurable program that allows YOU to control the complexity and format of TEACHER ms : Yep, pre-algebra and algebra I :) AFA Bard : math problems -- this one is HIGHLY recommended for any age student that has trouble with basic skills AFA Bard : PRIME NUMBERS is a great program that let's the computer simulate the Sieve of Eratosthenes -- and SHAPE TEACHER will make any pre-schooler go nuts saying SQUARE and CIRCLE pointing to everything in your home. Last, but not least... AFA Bard : I recommend CALCULUS and a good look at the MANY hypermedia math programs in our STUDIOWARE library. AFA Bard : REMEMBER.. if YOU have any public domain stuff - PLEASE submit it to our library! One file each month receives MAJOR KUDOS and a FREE HOUR to reward budding authors. Done. AFA Bard : Welcome MacRight... GREAT screen name! AFC Tooter : Bravo Bard!!!! What a performance! AFA Bard : (::: bowing :::) AFC Tooter : ::::::::: MacRight : Thanks Bard. AFC Tooter : Hi MacRight. Welcome to the Ed chat. Negotiator : Great sound, Ted. Do it again. AFA Bard : We're talking about MATH SOFTWARE.. any preferences, MacRight? AFA Bard : (Gayle's a bit under the weather .. if she returns, let's send her some collective home remedies!) TEACHER ms : I tutor Elem Mat on Wed night in IES in Study Skills room... AFA Bard : (no flying food, Tooter!) AFC Tooter : Like a new computer! AFC Tooter : The Macros on my other software, again. TEACHER ms : if you have any students I can help !! AFA Bard : Murray... what kind of questions, etc. do you get most often? MacRight : What grade level of software? AFA Bard : Hiya Scottie! TEACHER ms : Mainly prime numbers, fractions, and percent AFA Bard : Any level, MacRight. AFL Gayle : Sorry about that. :( AFA Bard : Rehi Gayle!! (::: sending Chicken Soup :::) BCS Frank : ReHi, Gayle, Steve :) AFC Tooter : Chicken soup or modem soup? MaryEz : How about Hot Lemonade and honey!! AFC SteveB : reFrank :) AFL Gayle : OK. Time to announce our winner tonight of our free hour! AFC SteveB : Hot Tea maybe? TEACHER ms : Of course it depend on the age and grade level, Bard :) AFA Bard : Yum! AFL Marty : Chili is good for a cold. AFL Marty : Really hot chili. AFC Tooter : Sitting here sipping luke coffee. AFL Gayle : Moose Gunn wins for using the secret word, algebra! :) AFL Gayle : *Applause* JohnR65 : Put lots of tabasco in it! AFA Bard : Congrats to MOOSE GUNN!!!!!!! Great, Cheryl!!!!!!!! AFC Tooter : The food fight's bac k!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! MaryEz : ()()()()()() TEACHER ms : Yeah !!!! AFA Bard : ()()()()()()()()()()()()() Negotiator : Yeah, Moose Gunn! :) BCS Frank : Way to go Moose!!!! AFL Marty : Yeah John! AFA Bard : tobasco, John? LOL! AFC SteveB : *Cheer*! AFC Tooter : Yeah Moose. Let's hear the old Moose call!!! Moose Gunn : Thanks! I've enjoyed the evening! I'll be sure to return another night! AFL Gayle : (Great idea, Marty, but doesn't work when you're allergic to tomatoes. :( TEACHER ms : Say it again, Moose ??:) AFL Marty : Oh. AFC Tooter : *mooo* AFL Marty : Oh well, nevermind. :) AFL Gayle : You will see a free nonprime time hour credited to your account soon. AFL Gayle : I appreciate the thought, however, Marty. :) AFA Bard : Whatta great chat... remember, folks, UPLOAD MATH SOFTWARE (ANY software!) Let's show folks how AFL Marty : :) TEACHER ms : hope you get well soon, Gayle !!! Moose Gunn : Thanks, again. :) AFA Bard : creative this group really is!!! Negotiator : Is the moo sound in the files somewhere, Toot. I don't have it installed. AFL Gayle : Our topic next week is software for language arts and reading. Same time, same AFL Gayle : place, same station. ;) AFC Tooter : I'll give it to you. It's a nice one. AFL Gayle : AND one free hour again to give away. :) Moose Gunn : O.K. guys, just remember, you have to work with me. AFL Gayle : Thanks, Murray. (Me, too!) TEACHER ms : :) Negotiator : Toot, did you ask about Scrapbook and math? AFA Bard : Have a GREAT week in the trenches, folks! Edited log will be posted ASAP. :)))))))) AFA Bard : Feel better, Gayle. We're all thinking of you! 9/8/91 9:12:43 PM Closing Chat Log.