2/11/90 8:11:23 PM Opening "America Online Log" for recording. AFL Wiggy : Welcome to the Apple II Education Forum and tonight's AFL Wiggy : conference about telecommunications and the Soviet AFL Wiggy : Union. As usual, I have announcements before we AFL Wiggy : start so hold on for a couple of minutes... AFL Wiggy : Hot Shot! Yes, each of the conference halls on A.O. AFL Wiggy : now has a new feature called Hot Shots. If you are AFL Wiggy : on a Mac, you have already seen the Hot Shot file; if AFL Wiggy : you are on an Apple II, You will have to do an Open- AFL Wiggy : Apple-T and then choose the Hot Shots from the menu AFL Wiggy : bar. Go ahead... Give it a try. I'll wait a few AFL Wiggy : seconds before moving on to the next macro. :) AFL Wiggy : The Apple II Education Forum is pleased to welcome AFL Wiggy : Virtual Realities to the Direct Connect area. V.R. AFL Wiggy : is a new company that has great plans for the IIgs. AFL Wiggy : Learn about their new digitizer; learn about their AFL Wiggy : ideas for future software and hardware. Leave a AFL Wiggy : message for them in AED's Direct Connect area to let AFL Wiggy : them know how pleased you are that they are taking AFL Wiggy : an interest in education! AFL Wiggy : * Future Conferences here in AED AFL Wiggy : * Feb. 15 - Training Teachers to use computers AFL Wiggy : * Feb. 19 - Brainstorming session AFL Wiggy : * Feb. 22 - Computers in the media center AFL Wiggy : * Feb. 26 - Teenagers and Stress AFL Wiggy : * All events will be here in AED AFL Wiggy : AFL Wiggy : And now, back to our event... AFL Wiggy : Almost a year ago, I went to the Soviet Union and I AFL Wiggy : felt sad that there was no way I could figure on AFL Wiggy : setting up a telecommunications project between my AFL Wiggy : students and students in the Soviet Union. There was AFL Wiggy : just no possible way it could be done... Or so I AFL Wiggy : thought until I met Bill Davis (BusyBill) here on AFL Wiggy : America Online. I guess I had no imagination, AFL Wiggy : because Bill has done what I thought was impossible. AFL Wiggy : Rather than me doing the usual 10 introductory AFL Wiggy : paragraphs, I have asked our guest, BusyBill to tell AFL Wiggy : us all about his project himself. Before I introduce AFL Wiggy : him, I would like to go over the ground rules for the AFL Wiggy : conference, though. AFL Wiggy : We HATE using protocol here in the AED conferences. I AFL Wiggy : do ask that you please respect our guest and the other AFL Wiggy : members by allowing Bill to finish his camments and AFL Wiggy : answers to questions before you ask your own. Please AFL Wiggy : do not step all over those people who are speaking; I AFL Wiggy : don't want to send for the Protocol Police! AFL Wiggy : With that out of the way, I would like to introduce AFL Wiggy : our guest, Bill Davis, who is working on the unique AFL Wiggy : project of linking his students with students in the AFL Wiggy : USSR. At a time when the entire world is watching AFL Wiggy : the remarkable events in the Soviet Union, he and his AFL Wiggy : students have a remarkable vantage point! So, please AFL Wiggy : Welcome BusyBill, and then allow him to tell us more AFL Wiggy : about his project. Welcome, Bill! Busy Bill : Zdrastvuitye, moi druzya! AFL Wiggy : Welcome, Bill! (huh???) Busy Bill : I'll do the rest in English for the sake of sanity! Busy Bill : Thanks, for letting me come and share some of the exciting things with yo. Busy Bill : Simply put, the efforts of some terrific folks in Alaska have allowed us Busy Bill : to set up some telecommunications with Soviet students in Providenia, Siberia. Busy Bill : We've (Illinois) been able to exchange E-Mail with the Soviet school with Busy Bill : an Apple IIgs, Datalink 2400, and AppleWorks GS. Busy Bill : It's quite a tale that had to overcome both political red tape Busy Bill : and technical problems! Busy Bill : Don't know where to start reallY! What might you want to know? BostnFrank: Bill, re your opening: How do you switch between Cyrillic & Latin alphabets? Busy Bill : That's what got us started. I diddled a font (Cyrillic 12) to use in Busy Bill : AppleWorks GS. The Alaska teachers were interested. Now it's used in USSR! BostnFrank: So you send in Cyrillic/Russian? Busy Bill : Yes, and mixed with English . AWGS is great! AFL Wiggy : I have seen and printed out some of the files... They are great! BostnFrank: Oy, the two Steves didn't know what they were starting! Busy Bill : The font is called RUSSKEYS and is available in the Word Processing Forum. SheridanVB: I understand there are only six trunk lines for telephones. Compare the speed SheridanVB: and accuracy of communications with what we have become used to, please. Busy Bill : Actually (Don't get angry) we have not been able to link directly yet. Busy Bill : Let me explain how we do it. Busy Bill : Joe Davis, a Nome Alaska teacher brought the IIgs etc to Providenia. Busy Bill : He tried to send files directly, but no go. The Soviet kids sent their Busy Bill : files by loading them to disk which was flown across the Bering Sea by Busy Bill : Tom Busch (KNOM Radio) in a Piper Navajo. They were put on Crystal Net BBS Busy Bill : in Nome where we downloaded them. Uploaded our files that were then flown Busy Bill : back across to the Soviets. Got some good news about direct connect, though! Busy Bill : The Soviets have decided to set up a Satellite Dish in Magadan and WANT direct Busy Bill : connect son! SheridanVB: I knew there was a catch to Glasnost...Are we yet permitted to start a database SheridanVB: of USA and Russia classroom teachers that are ready to directly link with the SheridanVB: joint assistance of governments and business? I'm ready!! BostnFrank: You could sell tickets. SheridanVB: I'll take two. Spazeba! BostnFrank: Sounds like you have some very dedicated people "on-line." AFL Wiggy : (I wonder when Soviet Online will become a reality). :) Busy Bill : We've received several sets of letters. Now the Soviet kids are getting Soko : How about the assistance of AOL? (Oh I forgot schools don't count here) SheridanVB: Can Apple move in and become McApple with greater profits? BostnFrank: :) Busy Bill : Apple in Russian is yablokha! SheridanVB: Would it be possible one day since I am a stock holder to support certain SheridanVB: business development areas over another? BostnFrank: Busy Bill : The Soviets have ordered 12 IIgses, didn't want Macs! AFL Wiggy : Yay!] AFL FrankD: Couldn't AFFORD them. :) AFL FrankD: (Yablokha Dva) :) Busy Bill : Joe Davis has the OK to travel to Magadan for two years and set up networks. SheridanVB: Who and where is Joe Davis? BostnFrank: [good grief, another computer language to learn... Russian.] Busy Bill : Joe is a teacher in Nome, AK who does all the footwork in USSR/Nome. Busy Bill : He once called Gorbachev to get the OK to open up transfers! MaryJ7 : I thought there were trade restriction concerning computer equipment? AFL FrankD: There are, Mary. And software also. Busy Bill : Is is OK to post the number of Crystal Net in Nome, for those interested? AFL Wiggy : Please do, Bill! BostnFrank: Please! AFA GayleK: Yes, Bill, please do. Do you have it handy now? :) AFL FrankD: One of them, Mary. Busy Bill : That's Crystal Net BBS (907)443-5559, 1200 baud (IIgs based!) Dan Willequer SheridanVB: General cost to call Crystal Net? Busy Bill : It's similar to a call from IL to CA, but the connection is not clean. AFL FrankD: :) SheridanVB: As in static or eavsdropping? AFL FrankD: Exon messed THAT up too, huh? :) AFL FrankD: Evesdropping you'll never notice. Busy Bill : Static, didn't think of eavsdropping! SheridanVB: Security clearances required? AFL FrankD: Not for a PUBLIC line, there would be no security clearances required. AFL Wiggy : Bill... How did you get all the equipment for the Providenia school? Did they buy it??? Busy Bill : An Apple dealer in Anchorage donated everything! MaryJ7 : Or did you pay $10,000 to join the Soviet Computer Club? :) Busy Bill : That's ROUBLES! MaryJ7 : Sorry can't tell yablokas from oranges. Busy Bill : Yablokha Dva navsegda! Apple II forever rhymes in Russian! BostnFrank: Of course Soviet students are eligible to join the Boston Computer Society. :) BostnFrank: They'd get the out of New England discount too. AFL Wiggy : Sheesh...everybody's getting a plug in here. :) AFL Wiggy : Wow! And how did you get the contact with the Radio Station in Nome? Busy Bill : The radio station manager had traveled to USSR with the Boy Scouts. SheridanVB: Did Gorbachev respond directly to Nome teacher? Busy Bill : The Magadan governor had said, "nyet" to further transfer. Moscow said, Da!" AFL Wiggy : Bill... You mentioned fund raising in your email today... can you expand on that? What are you AFL Wiggy : raising funds for and what is the Soviet school doing to help out? Busy Bill : We're raising $ to send one of our students to Providenia for a visit. Busy Bill : The Soviets sent some goodies to sell in a raffle to help! Busy Bill : Not many folks outside of Alaska/Providenia seem to know about it. BostnFrank: How should we (enthusiastic AO'ers) help the enterprise? AFL FrankD: Don't get Apple involved. We'll be doing it on Macs. :) BostnFrank: :) Busy Bill : Just keep it before folks as a reality. Our classes will CONNECT. We're sure! AFL Wiggy : It sure would be neat if you could bring some of them over here.. Have you all given that some AFL Wiggy : thought? That would really make big news! (and I'd like to have them as guests here in AED). :) Busy Bill : The Soviets invited themselves-offered to exchange 15 students/teachers! AFL Wiggy : Great! Busy Bill : They offered to teach us about Yupik Eskimos, too! BostnFrank: Hmmm... anyone have a hat we can pass around here? AFL Wiggy : Yes.. There should be some way to raise funds for that here on A.O..... don't be afraid to ask for AFL Wiggy : $$$ on the message boards here in AED. :) Busy Bill : I have a VERY deserving student who's planning to spend her college $ to go! Negotiator: What messages did you and your students get back from the Soviets, Bill? AFL Wiggy : Bill.... Is there any way that we could see some of the files that you all have excahnged. I would AFL Wiggy : imagine there are a lot of people interested in seing what the Soviets are saying... and the AFL Wiggy : American Teenagers are saying back. Busy Bill : They responded individually and as classes. I'll upload all ya want! AFA GayleK: Great, Bill! Please do. :) BostnFrank: We'd like to see ASCII text and AWGS files, please. :) Busy Bill : You'll need the RUSSKEYS font to make sense of the Soko : Wouldn't they comes as RSCII files Frank? :) LennieS1 : What age groups of kids have been corresponding? Russian, though. LennieS1 : Any elementary? BostnFrank: & could there be a way other US school groups can add their comments? Busy Bill : Teachers and kids from 10-19 years old are writing. Busy Bill : Well, the teachers seem older! AFL Marty : All teachers seem older. Hazards of the job. :) SheridanVB: Teachers have a lot of class!!! KiraA : My name is Russian, named after a novel's character. I wish the author were BostnFrank: {I stand corrected :( } KiraA : alive today to see this. AFL Wiggy : Bill... What objections did the governor in Siberia have that he said Nyet to further exchanges? Busy Bill : He didn't want to get into trouble from Moscow, I think. He did anyway! AFL Wiggy : LOL! He couldn't win! :) BostnFrank: That's what happens when you're in the middle of changing operating systems. AFL Wiggy : Did Apple help out at all? Did you try to contact them (or did they tell you, "No, you can only have AFL Wiggy : a Mac to do this.")? Busy Bill : Don't know if Cupertino responded, but the dealer handed over everything Busy Bill : asked for - even AWGS. AFL Wiggy : I hope he (the dealer) got lots of free air time on the Nome Radio Station for his efforts. Busy Bill : There's a special relationship between Alaskans and their Apple dealer. Busy Bill : I have been unable to duplicate it in Illinois! ;) AFL FrankD: The dealers don't carry refrigerators, and the Alaskans pay in seal meat? Busy Bill : When the radio station manager was in Providenia, he met a teacher who had Busy Bill : listened to his broadcasts for 5 years! She said, That was your voice!" AFL FrankD: And even RECOGNIZED it? Yeahhh! :) AFL Wiggy : What types of things are the kids writing about? Are politics important in the letters or are they AFL Wiggy : more involved with everyday life? Busy Bill : Most of the kids write about music, sports, and their parents. Busy Bill : They write about peace and how they want a good job! Negotiator: Sounds like TheTooters Scrapbook USA AFL Wiggy : ScrapBook USSR? Busy Bill : They beg us to write back and to visit. They even sent a videotape!Busy Bill : They kids were great. One Soviet kid poked another and said, in English, Busy Bill : 'You got ugly face!" They sounded like our kids in front of a camera. Negotiator: I missed the first 10 minutes. How does info get from Alaska to Russia, phone? AFL Wiggy : In this case, not yet... the files fly by plane. :) AFL Wiggy : But soon, it is hoped, the files will travel via telephone. Busy Bill : We tried phones, need a new radar dish. Soviets are setting one up. BostnFrank: Hmmm. How 'bout AppleFest/Providenia,'91? BostnFrank: AFL Wiggy : Sounds good to me.... I want to go to Siberia. :) Soko : Almost as exciting as New Jersey 90 Busy Bill : Remember, with the right shoes you could WALK to the North Pole! AFL Wiggy : Have you had any official reaction to your project here in the US? Does the State department or the AFL Wiggy : Education department know about it? AFL FrankD: You can BET the State Department knows about it. :) Busy Bill : I've already talked to "officials" before because I read Russian books and Busy Bill : went to the U of C. AFL Wiggy : I would think that this would make a great human interest story... perhaps we can all get the AFL Wiggy : word out... Busy Bill : We got some space in the Chicago Tribune! BostnFrank: Is ok to tell the story in user group newsletters? AFL Wiggy : In the meantime, don't be afraid to post messages in the Let's Discuss area about the project... and AFL Wiggy : about fund raising efforts. And be sure to attach fund raising notices to the files you upload to the AFL Wiggy : AED libraries so that everybody will remember. :) Negotiator: So, in light of Russian governor's hesitation, what's next in the project? Busy Bill : The Soviets have invited select teachers to go to Magadan to assist in Busy Bill : setting up telecommunications between their cities and USA! AFL Wiggy : Bill... Don't you have an official news release that you could send to the User Groups so that they AFL Wiggy : can write about this? Busy Bill : Yes, such a creature exists. I'll convert to ASCII and upload. Negotiator: Will you have any more communications by plane from Alaska? AFL FrankD: Great! Just may put my "walking shoes" on for that one. :) Busy Bill : We sent something at least once a month pretty faithfully. Negotiator: Have they responded once a month/ Busy Bill : We receive letters/packages pretty regularly. AFL Wiggy : Frank, I would love for the BCS to write about this (and mention AED of course). :) BostnFrank: Absolutely! BostnFrank: <--- dusting off typewriter. AFL Wiggy : Let's see.. suggestions we have had tonight... AFL Wiggy : 1. Mention the fund raising in AED's Let's Discuss... AFL Wiggy : 2. Upload the Russian/English files to the AED libraries... AFL Wiggy : 3. Upload the press release in ASCII form to the AED libraries (I'll make sure ForumLink gets it). Negotiator: How soon do you expect to have data communications established? Busy Bill : Hard to say. Joe starts working there in April... AFL Wiggy : Bill, If Joe needs an assistant, I am free to go with him. :) AFL Wiggy : Frank... I have the release somewhere at home and it really did help me make sense of what was going AFL Wiggy : on with the project... and getting the two Davis's straight. :) Negotiator: Bill, what problems do you anticipate in setting up telecommunciations? Busy Bill : There may still be problems with line noise, since there's so much from Busy Bill : Alaska normally. AFL FrankD: Combine that with maximum sunspot activity and your ears really hurt. :) AFL Wiggy : Waht Telecom Software do you use? Busy Bill : I use ProTerm, They use DataLink's. LennieS1 : Are you looking for more students from other parts of the country to participate? AFL FrankD: :) LennieS1 : I have some students who would be interested Busy Bill : I'm certain the kids in Magadan would love to write to you. Call Crystal Net. Busy Bill : K sozhaleniyu. Hard to type Russian w/o Cyrillic! AFL Wiggy : Ah, but it is so much easier for me to read! (I still don;t understand it, though). :) Negotiator: Do you send the messages in Russian, and they respond in English? Busy Bill : Most messages are in both languages. Soviet kids are not shy about trying Busy Bill : English. They just write their hearts out! Negotiator: Do you recommend any basic Russian text for your kids? Busy Bill : Best is anything with tapes/records. You must hear it! Busy Bill : I made a stack called RUSSTACK in Ed Forum that gets you started. AFL Wiggy : Yes... Russtack uses HyperStudio and introduces phases. BostnFrank: It's folks like you that set loose a little hope for the future. AFL Wiggy : Frank... That's a great way of putting it! Busy Bill : Spasiba bolshoye! BostnFrank: And here we not only get a little hope... we get a chance to get involved! BostnFrank: You're going to get a lot of letters on this in "Let's Discuss... " BostnFrank: Any chance of posting a "Basic Russian" dictionary? Busy Bill : I'm working on an alphabet stack, could mail you a paper copy of info. AFL FrankD: heehee. Just post the 45 different verb forms! :) AFL FrankD: That'll make 'em cringe. :) BostnFrank: Uh, what's a verb? Busy Bill : Verbs are not hard for Americans - Aspects are! Tamira : usually quick study if I can hear it BostnFrank: --- aspects ? --- AFL FrankD: Positive and negative aspects of the situation.... :) Tamira : read better than speak, and understand about half of what I read Busy Bill : Aspects, Perfective and imperfective- kinda like Greek that way. BostnFrank: oh, sure. I knew that. :) AFL FrankD: heehee... nothing quite like the Greeks. :) Tamira : I like languages......like to learn new things AFL FrankD: xo adelfos! :) Tamira : Metaxa is about all the Greek I know :) Busy Bill : Efkharisto! AFL Wiggy : Hmmm sounds like Russian is going to be harder to learn than I thought. :) AFL FrankD: It's not that hard at ALL, Wigs, once you get past the alphabet. :) AFL FrankD: Sure easier than the oriental languages! :( AFL Wiggy : Well, once Bill has finished his alphabet stack, I'll have no problem. :) Tamira : well if you decide to have classes.... :) Busy Bill : The alphabet is so logical that Russians have no word for "spell." AFL FrankD: Buy Berlitz. :) AFL FrankD: And there is only ONE accent per word. AFL FrankD: No "secondary" accents like we have. BostnFrank: They must love English. :) AFL FrankD: The NICE part is that they have a separate word for EVERYTHING! AFL FrankD: Say "box" in English, and you can immediately think of three or four things.. AFL FrankD: that might mean. AFL FrankD: NOT so in Russian. Tamira : LOL Frank BostnFrank: Can the Cyrillic be transposed letter for letter with the Latin alphabet? Tamira : I dont think so... Busy Bill : Nope. Phoneme/grapheme correspondence is too different. Negotiator: Will you keep this ed forum informed about the progress on telecommuncations Negotiator: with the RUssians, Bill. AFL Wiggy : That's a good question, Negotiator... I would love to have updates on yor project, Bill. Busy Bill : I worked hard to get the IIgs keyboard set for 32 graphemes. Essential if Busy Bill : the Soviets and we are going to telecommunicate. BostnFrank: I'd like to know more about how you use RUSSKEYS. AFL FrankD: Which ones did you leave out, Bill? Busy Bill : I took off ` ~ | \ " ' { } [ } AFL Wiggy : Well, now that system 5.0 allows the use of the option key for letters, perhaps some of those other AFL Wiggy : cyrillic fonts will now work completely. AFL FrankD: Not without major rework, Wigs. AFL FrankD: The option throws you into Hi-ASCII. The available Cyrillic fonts I know of.. AFL FrankD: don't use it. AFL Wiggy : You've checked them out, Frank? Oh well. :( Busy Bill : I've used the extended character sets- too difficult to type. Busy Bill : RUSSKEYS comes with an AWGS SuperHires keyboard remap screen. AFL Wiggy : (and RussKeys is available in the Apple II Word Processing Forum). BostnFrank: I'm wondering about using RUSSKEYS with SuperFonts on 8 bit Apples. AFL FrankD: Now I REALLY have to dig into the RUSSKEYS font. :) Busy Bill : Yes, RUSSKEYS works perfectly with SuperFonts! AFL FrankD: Tole 'ya, Frank! :) BostnFrank: That's the problem with computers... there's never anything to do. AFL FrankD: heehee BostnFrank: :) Busy Bill : RUSSKEYS is a standard IIgs font file - I just remapped the keyboard. AFL FrankD: Bill, here's a good one for you. AFL FrankD: Have you tried importing RUSSKEYS into Publish It! 2.0 yet? AFL FrankD: And evaluated the results? AFL FrankD: If you have, would like to hear about it. AFL FrankD: If not, I'll do it myself. Busy Bill : No, but since it's a standard IIgs font file....? AFL FrankD: I'm sure that would interest many. BostnFrank: Either way, we want to hear. AFL FrankD: Standard GS fonts leave a little to be desired in resolution in PI. AFL FrankD: But that's when they're compared with the normal PI fonts. AFL FrankD: I'll take a look at it then. AFL FrankD: Thanks. Busy Bill : What I'd really like is Cyrillic Fastfont so we could use it on screen with Busy Bill : AWGS telecom module. AFL FrankD: :) BostnFrank: Do you exchange any AWGS graphics? AFL FrankD: Waiting for them to fix AWGS telecom so it REALLY WORKS! :) BostnFrank: Waiting for Beagle to work on AWGS. Busy Bill : We haven't exchanged graphics yet, but it's in the works. We want to use Busy Bill : HyperStudio with the Soviet kids next. Busy Bill : Thank you, all of you , very much!